SECRETARY OF DEFENSE Pete Hegseth is under increasing fire for a double-tap strike, first reported by The Intercept in early September, in which the U.S. military killed two survivors of the Trump administration’s initial boat strike in the Caribbean on September 2.
The Washington Post recently reported that Hegseth personally ordered the follow-up attack, giving a spoken order “to kill everybody.” Multiple military legal experts, lawmakers, and now confidential sources within the government who spoke with The Intercept say Hegseth’s actions could result in the entire chain of command being investigated for a war crime or outright murder.
“Those directly involved in the strike could be charged with murder under the UCMJ or federal law,” said Todd Huntley, a former Staff Judge Advocate who served as a legal adviser on Joint Special Operations task forces conducting drone strikes in Afghanistan and elsewhere, using shorthand for the Uniform Code of Military Justice. “This is about as clear of a case being patently illegal that subordinates would probably not be able to successfully use a following-orders defense.”
This is actually the example they use of an illegal order in the DOD manual.
Page 1117 18.3.2.1 https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23892053-dod-law-of-war-manual-june-2015-updated-july-2023/
Nooo, but trump and all his totally cool and not criminal bros said that the president cannot give an illegal order…
No no, he limits himself to “Clearly illegal” orders, normal illegal is beneath him.
100% nothing will happen, or they will just get pardoned. USA is done. Kaput. All hail Nazi USA.
Fairly sure the pardons are already filled out and signed preemptively.
They don’t even waste time by having them individually singed. Just copy and paste!
Ooh ooh how bout an autopen!
with fascists, every accusation is an admission
It’s fucking comical how many Americans seem to think that the collapse of their entire legal system is just a blip and there’s a “normal” to go back to.
It’s a bit like going to see a magician- if you catch a glimpse of how the trick is done, the spell is broken. There’s no going back. Everyone is now fully aware that accountability only exists because of shared suspension of disbelief that it might not. A new administration doesn’t fix this. Your constitution and legislation has been fully exposed as lacking enforcement measures. There isn’t any coming back from that, regardless of who’s in the big chair.
It’s already been collapsed for years though. Normal people don’t even get trials anymore. We get outrageously high bail amounts and plea-bargains (forced confessions, that’s what they are) so we will spend 2 years in prison instead of 5 awaiting trial.
Want to prove your innocence even if it means spending years in pretrial jail? Guess what? They’ll end up dismissing the charges a week before your trial starts because they don’t think they’ll get a conviction. You’re not officially acquitted so the prosecutor’s success rate stays high AND you still were imprisoned for years so it’s a win-win for them.
You know that Germany still exists, though, right? Something will happen…
No other countries are coming to save you from yourselves.
So to be clear, you’re suggesting the reason for allied forces joining WW2 was to save Germany from itself?
I’m not disagreeing that Trump will pardon everyone involved, I’m not disagreeing that no other country cares if the US comes out the other end, I’m just saying, these regimes have a history of not sticking around long term. So I’m disagreeing with the statement that “nothing will happen”. Shit is happening and will continue to happen until their reign of terror is brought to an end, just like WW2.
It’s not “their” reign of terror. They are a symptom.
This shit is the fault of all Americans. Those who voted for it, those who enable it, and those who are sitting on their asses either thinking this ends with a new administration or who are waiting for someone else to come put Nazis in the ground for them.
Blaming this on the Trump admin is like blaming a toddler for bringing a loaded handgun to school.
The adults in the room number in the hundreds of millions and you’re doing fuck all.
Your analogy can’t have it both ways. Either the allies saved Germany from itself, implying there was a good portion saved from the fascist portion, OR the Nazi party was the fault of all Germans, those who voted for it, those who enable it, etc., and blaming any portion on Nazis/Hitler is like blaming a toddler. So which is it?
I’m 86% convinced you’re a divisiveness bot at this point. Prove me wrong.
Germany was saved from itself as an undeserved RESULT of the allies’ victory. The allies didn’t go in to improve the lives of Nazi enabling German citizens, clearly.
Isn’t Europe continuing friendly relations with the US also enabling? Can’t you vote in better governments who will draw a line in the sand against America? Still doing military exercises with us? Really? After Denmark was threatened with an invasion of Greenland? Why would Denmark let JD Vance go there and film a propaganda video while that was happening! Why?! Why let him do that? It’s against Europe’s interest to be in bed with us now. It certainly was considered enabling when they were doing it with Nazi Germany. Besides the way Europe is voting they’re headed down the same path. In 10 years we could have a left-wing America and a fascist Europe.
But I mean unlike Nazi Germany, the US is untouchable militarily speaking so it’s a moot point.
Even before the USA was kaput, double tapping became typical US strategy under the Obama administration, which makes me even more confident that nobody will face any consequences for this. To try Trump they’d have to try Obama.
To try Trump they’d have to try Obama.
Ok, and?
I really don’t understand why people (GOPers mainly, it seems) trot this line out every time there’s the “threat” of a Repub being (gasp) held accountable for something…
We don’t fucking CARE! GOOD! Prosecute the criminals! It doesn’t matter what side they’re on politically!
Some of us don’t hang our hat on individual cults of personality and just want the rules applied equally all the way across. Why is this so difficult to understand?
We don’t fucking CARE! GOOD! Prosecute the criminals! It doesn’t matter what side they’re on politically!
You don’t care, but the people in power do. That’s the point I was making.
I’ve seen this sentiment a lot lately. It’s just a very bad argument.
We aren’t going to type out a list of every US war criminal ever. We are talking about current events and want the active war criminals stopped.
Obviously we should try all war criminals, but let’s stop the war crimes first
“held liable” means some bad press in ‘radical left’ media at this point, right?
Held liable by whom? The President who absolutely would say he agreed with it? The legislature that will talk a good game but fold before doing anything important? The courts who are owned by the parties? Or the police who want this to be SOP, and wouldn’t enforce any orders for arrest?
UCMJ is its own system enforced by the military with its own courts. Hegeseth will probably avoid any repercussions, but holding the chain of command responsible for state sponsored murder will send a clear message about obeying illegal orders.
And not doing so sends a different, no less clear, message…
I guess some of these people expect to still be around in a couple years when there is a new administration that might feel like it’s a good idea to prosecute people for crimes they committed for trump.
Aint a chance in hell anyone will face charges if its Kamala or Hug-a-Nazi Newsom. It would have to be progressive Democrat in office. In months after Jan 6 Trump’s head was on the chopping block, public support was gone and yet there was zero interest in Biden or his justice dept to go after him and the democrats didn’t even press him on it.
I am hopeful that we might get a progressive. That’s why the DNC didn’t want a real primary, it’s what the people want.
The murders weren’t committed in the U.S. so…
That’s what should happen, but I won’t be holding my breath.
See that’s why they make everyone pull the trigger when they commit murder. Now they’re all complicit, and they have to work for trump and keep him in power. Because if someone with a spine that actually follows the law and constitution gets into office they will face court-martial.
But we all know that they’ll just get raked over the coals by some committee and told to retire, if that, should a dem take office.
What absolute moron would obey that order?
I could see how maybe you could believe there was justification for the initial strike but there can be no justification for killing people who are now defenceless. Although why not just board the vessel and take everyone into custody, why instantly resort to deadly force, did they have information that the people on the boat were heavily armed or otherwise able to threaten a US naval vessel?
Which means, as the law is being followed in the US right now, only the plebs at the bottom might be held responsible.
Could be, but won’t. At least, not under this regime.
Maybe its ethics. Maybe some folks in the chain of command have the fear of God in them. Maybe there’s just better pay in the private sector and now is as good a time as any to cash out. But I suspect stories like this are going to be increasingly common in the run up to the '26 election.
we can hope for some high-profile resignations and maybe an outspoken admiral or something. And remember, it’s only Trump’s DOJ until it isn’t anymore, and I think the statute of limitations on murder is more than 3 years…
These idiots will never face consequences until the citizens get angry enough to start guillotine trials
He is a murderer… all of them are.
“Respect the chain of command.” - Babylon 5 TV show
Same thing Democrats said recently. Same thing Milley said last time Trump put soldiers on streets years ago. Back then Trump also said Milley should be hanged for saying it.
Y’all mother fuckers ebeying in advance. These assholes will be held accountable. Call your representatives! Don’t assume their power is so great because it’s not!
Just like the Jan 6 hearings, they will drag it out for political points, but have no intention to seek actual charges, institutional change, military reform or anything.
It will just be: “Look at all the evil shit they did! Don’t you wish something could be done! Oh well. Also Maduro bad m’kay, drugs bad m’kay, Hamas bad m’kay, we love troops m’kay. Hearing adjourned!”
50/50 they pardon everyone or Trump uses this opportunity to forcefully retire more generals and get Hegseth out.
